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Lookonthesunnyside

People CHOOSING to be ignorant!!

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Lookonthesunnyside

Okay, I just need to get these ridiculous examples of people being ignorant and living in denial off my chest.

Exhibit A: My friend today talking about a friend of hers who is very very promiscuous and never uses condoms, has hpv. Came up in a convo about stds and I said I wouldnt be surprised if she has herpes. (Has had multiple partners for years without using protection). This friend knows I have it, knows I dont think you have to be promiscuous to get it (dont get me wrong), but that it is common and that the more people you're with the more you're playing against the odds. She says "well, no, shes been tested and stuff." I was like "yeah...but its not included in std screenings" (as I've told her) and she said "well, wouldnt you know though.." Even though I have told her, its very very common and most people DONT know. I re-told her the stats and she refused to believe that it was a possibility by saying "well, she's had hpv so hopefully that made her smarten up" Again reinstating that she didnt think it was possible, KNOWING that she continues years later to keep having unprotected sex. But nooo its not even possible.

Exhibit B: Another close friend who does not know my status telling me that she's been extremely itchy and has red bumps on the inside area (aka. not shaving bumps area) of her vag. Tells me straight up that she's afraid she has herpes and that she feels it would ruin her life. I am supportive and encourage her to get tested. A week later she hasnt gotten tested and is talking about how she thinks she might sleep with this guy she just started dating because she needs to get laid.

Exhibit C: My ex boyfriend saying after a good month of knowing my situation, having done "tons" of research, asking if its possible for him to get it from me by me giving him oral sex. Because he knows that the virus can "go" to either part of the body. Oh and that he also read on a "herpes" website that its found in people's saliva. This is after I'd given him head a handful of times without accepting anything in return to try and keep him happy.

Exhibit D: Friend's bf breaks out in ulcers on his penis 2 days after having unprotected sex with her. (This is a girl who gets extremely itchy "yeast infections" every month after her period so bad that she's cracked and raw down there, and couldnt figure out why yeast treatments never worked) Her bf waits a full week to get a swab, is told it might be herpes but it comes back negative. Then has ANOTHER even worse outbreak, doesnt get checked again. She proceeds to talk to me soon after about her recurrent untreatable (hmm..weird?) yeast infections and that she says she has a "clogged gland" down there on the inside area of her vag. Later refers to the whole incident as "when we thought something was up". Knows my status and that I spent the 7 months previous struggling with my diagnosis.

Exhibit E: Another good friend calling it my "illness".

Exhibit F: (This is the real fucking kicker people) Ex boyfriend's mom is TOLD my status by my bf at the time (I know), freaks out. Even though her husband has cold sores aka HERPES, asks ex bf if she can get it through "hand towels". (Which is her reflecting on the many times I helped her do the dishes after dinner :-x) Then proceeds to say that the only way I can be allowed back in their house and that she'll be okay with the relationship is if the whole family knows because IF I took a shower, used a towel, HAD an outbreak, GOT it on that towel, LEFT it there damp, and someone IMMEDIATELY afterwards used my towel and HAPPENED to have a cut on them, that they COULD get it. Also, before I knew all this and was at their house, refused to talk to me or even make eye contact with me. That relationship ended after that and I never went back there.

Honestly, with the exception of that ignorant woman who I despise, my friends are intelligent, kind, great people. But when it comes to shit like this they refuse to let go of ignorant assumptions about the disease whenever it affects their lives. Nooo..blisters on your vagina and bf's dick? No way its herpes. Friend who has spent years having unprotected sex? Couldnt possibily have it. Itchy red bumps? Meh, just go have sex with someone. Husband who has oral herpes kissing your children and yourself? No problem. Me coming into the house with genital herpes? Sound the alarms!!!

GIVE ME A BREAK!

Bahhh I needed to get that out, it has all been eating me up inside! Phhew...its out. If anyone read through all that then thank you.

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gotitsowhat

Know what you mean....

Okay, I just need to get these ridiculous examples of people being ignorant and living in denial off my chest.

Exhibit A: My friend today talking about a friend of hers who is very very promiscuous and never uses condoms, has hpv. Came up in a convo about stds and I said I wouldnt be surprised if she has herpes. (Has had multiple partners for years without using protection). This friend knows I have it, knows I dont think you have to be promiscuous to get it (dont get me wrong), but that it is common and that the more people you're with the more you're playing against the odds. She says "well, no, shes been tested and stuff." I was like "yeah...but its not included in std screenings" (as I've told her) and she said "well, wouldnt you know though.." Even though I have told her, its very very common and most people DONT know. I re-told her the stats and she refused to believe that it was a possibility by saying "well, she's had hpv so hopefully that made her smarten up" Again reinstating that she didnt think it was possible, KNOWING that she continues years later to keep having unprotected sex. But nooo its not even possible.

Exhibit B: Another close friend who does not know my status telling me that she's been extremely itchy and has red bumps on the inside area (aka. not shaving bumps area) of her vag. Tells me straight up that she's afraid she has herpes and that she feels it would ruin her life. I am supportive and encourage her to get tested. A week later she hasnt gotten tested and is talking about how she thinks she might sleep with this guy she just started dating because she needs to get laid.

Exhibit C: My ex boyfriend saying after a good month of knowing my situation, having done "tons" of research, asking if its possible for him to get it from me by me giving him oral sex. Because he knows that the virus can "go" to either part of the body. Oh and that he also read on a "herpes" website that its found in people's saliva. This is after I'd given him head a handful of times without accepting anything in return to try and keep him happy.

Exhibit D: Friend's bf breaks out in ulcers on his penis 2 days after having unprotected sex with her. (This is a girl who gets extremely itchy "yeast infections" every month after her period so bad that she's cracked and raw down there, and couldnt figure out why yeast treatments never worked) Her bf waits a full week to get a swab, is told it might be herpes but it comes back negative. Then has ANOTHER even worse outbreak, doesnt get checked again. She proceeds to talk to me soon after about her recurrent untreatable (hmm..weird?) yeast infections and that she says she has a "clogged gland" down there on the inside area of her vag. Later refers to the whole incident as "when we thought something was up". Knows my status and that I spent the 7 months previous struggling with my diagnosis.

Exhibit E: Another good friend calling it my "illness".

Exhibit F: (This is the real fucking kicker people) Ex boyfriend's mom is TOLD my status by my bf at the time (I know), freaks out. Even though her husband has cold sores aka HERPES, asks ex bf if she can get it through "hand towels". (Which is her reflecting on the many times I helped her do the dishes after dinner :-x) Then proceeds to say that the only way I can be allowed back in their house and that she'll be okay with the relationship is if the whole family knows because IF I took a shower, used a towel, HAD an outbreak, GOT it on that towel, LEFT it there damp, and someone IMMEDIATELY afterwards used my towel and HAPPENED to have a cut on them, that they COULD get it. Also, before I knew all this and was at their house, refused to talk to me or even make eye contact with me. That relationship ended after that and I never went back there.

Honestly, with the exception of that ignorant woman who I despise, my friends are intelligent, kind, great people. But when it comes to shit like this they refuse to let go of ignorant assumptions about the disease whenever it affects their lives. Nooo..blisters on your vagina and bf's dick? No way its herpes. Friend who has spent years having unprotected sex? Couldnt possibily have it. Itchy red bumps? Meh, just go have sex with someone. Husband who has oral herpes kissing your children and yourself? No problem. Me coming into the house with genital herpes? Sound the alarms!!!

GIVE ME A BREAK!

Bahhh I needed to get that out, it has all been eating me up inside! Phhew...its out. If anyone read through all that then thank you.

I have a colleague who is suffering from symptoms that sound exactly like genital herpes. He has been to a number of doctors, was at one point told he has "non-specific urethritis" and cannot figure out what to do about his pain that comes and goes. I decided to level with him and told him that I have herpes and pointed out that his symptoms, sores, pain on urinating that is not a bacterial infection etc. are typical of herpes. He mentioned it to his doctor and his doctor just changed the subject. The doctor will not test him for it and he is convinced, therefore, that he doesn't have it. His wife just left him and I think the stress of it, and whatever led up to it, may have touched off a herpes outbreak. But no way will he or his doctors deal with that possibility.

No one seems to want to admit that they, or anyone they know, has herpes. If you quote the stats, they will question them or insist they must be wrong. Because no one talks about this little virus, everyone assumes it only happens rarely to promiscuous people.

So far, I have had no luck trying to get people I know with symptoms to go get tested--they are very ready to believe doctors who change the subject to avoid testing them.

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LoyalPaw

Damn!

That's really intense! Those friends of yours really have to listen to what you're saying...aren't you just the person for them to speak to about that kind of thing? Herpes is such a sentance that people block it out as a possibility.

I sure hope you feel better now...and hopefully they'll all wise up.

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jericho

Lookonthesunnyside, I am not even remotely surprised by your experience. Because the outbreaks are intermittent and can be mild, people will grasp at any possible alternative explanation. "Yeah, I think the sex the other day was just too rough." There's no limit to the nonsense people will convince themselves of to avoid getting tested.

If you quote the stats, they will question them or insist they must be wrong.

I had that experience multiple times, one with a woman I know to be quite intelligent. She was certain, though she had never looked into this herself, that the statistics were wrong.

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luckyCat

i know how you feel

I once started seeing an ex at a point last year. He knew my status and whenever we had sex (aka: whenever there was a blue moon eclipsing the sun and Mars, Jupiter and Venus were visible to the naked eye) it was ALWAYS on my stomach with my ass in the air so I didnt get my 'juices' on him.

Meanwhile in an earlier convo we had when first getting reaquainted he tells me one point he had sex with 2 women in the same week and upon asking I find out (of course) he didnt know the status of either partner.

Fast forward to one of our last arguments (basically over the fact that he wanted me to be exclusive to him despite a near sexless relationship) and when I confront with the fact that he's already willingly exposed himself STDs he tells me 'HE CAN TELL WHEN A WOMAN HAS IT"

I was dumbfounded...and extremely turned off.

Im so glad I walked away...I would rather be alone and by myself than with someone who chose to bury their head in the sand simply out of convenience.

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junebug

. . . and because of all these examples of "genius," I truly believe that the statistics will be 1 out of 2 by 2025. However, most folks (and their doctors) will be in denial.

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Was23
Okay, I just need to get these ridiculous examples of people being ignorant and living in denial off my chest.

Exhibit A: ...

Exhibit B: ...

Exhibit C: ...

Exhibit D: ...

Exhibit E: ...

Exhibit F: (This is the real fucking kicker people) ...

Phhew...its out. If anyone read through all that then thank you.

Actually, A-E are classic denial, with a strong measure of responsibility avoidance thrown in. (you don't have to admit you have herpes, and can act as if you don't, if you don't "officially" get declared infected with HSV).

Exhibit F is, as you say, pure ignorance, but IMO more forgivable (even though I understand that for you, it was probably the most personally painful since it was directed at you). Fear fueled by ignorance can make you very irrational.

Anyway, I enjoyed reading your "vent" (and the comments of others, too.)

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ntdc
. . . and because of all these examples of "genius," I truly believe that the statistics will be 1 out of 2 by 2025. However, most folks (and their doctors) will be in denial.

You can believe what you want but the data do not support it. More likely

it will become even less common in the next 10 years. Especially if anti-viral

prices come down or more powerful drugs are introduced.

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lifesstillgood
You can believe what you want but the data do not support it. More likely

it will become even less common in the next 10 years. Especially if anti-viral

prices come down or more powerful drugs are introduced.

The only problem with this line of thinking is that many people do not want to take medication. I am one of those people.

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ntdc

It just has to be enough people to perpetuate the declining trend, even if people all took medication it would still cause infection because it is not 100% effective. I never said it would be wiped it but i believe infection rates will continue to decrease.

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Guest Seatortuga

This is sad :( I hope one day I live in a world that doesn't dehumanize people like that, like in exhibit F. I'm sorry that happened to you, Sunnyside.

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Lookonthesunnyside

Thanks for the support/feedback guys! Its sooo frustrating to have intelligent people just disregard basic facts in favor of what they want to believe. But I guess people do that all the time, not just with herpes. I wish I could take it less personally, but its hard. But I definitely feel better after venting and getting this out to people who understand.

One thing though, if its believed that rates of infection will go down through the use of anti-virals, isnt this only accounting for those who are aware their status? If the majority of people who are spreading it are unaware, how would this make a difference really? I'm not trying to argue either way, I donno what the future holds. Just wondering how that would really affect rates of transmission, since the problem is that most people dont know.

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lifesstillgood
Thanks for the support/feedback guys! Its sooo frustrating to have intelligent people just disregard basic facts in favor of what they want to believe. But I guess people do that all the time, not just with herpes. I wish I could take it less personally, but its hard. But I definitely feel better after venting and getting this out to people who understand.

One thing though, if its believed that rates of infection will go down through the use of anti-virals, isnt this only accounting for those who are aware their status? If the majority of people who are spreading it are unaware, how would this make a difference really? I'm not trying to argue either way, I donno what the future holds. Just wondering how that would really affect rates of transmission, since the problem is that most people dont know.

The only way the amount of herpes cases is to decline in years to come without a vaccine available is if people dont have sex or kiss anyone. Don't think that will be happening anytime soon.

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ntdc

One thing though, if its believed that rates of infection will go down through the use of anti-virals, isnt this only accounting for those who are aware their status? If the majority of people who are spreading it are unaware, how would this make a difference really? I'm not trying to argue either way, I donno what the future holds. Just wondering how that would really affect rates of transmission, since the problem is that most people dont know.

Well the CDC reported in 2006 that herpes infection rates had dropped over the last 10 years. They do not really know why, some theories were the safe sex movement caused by HIV/AIDS, or possible widespread availability and awareness of drugs like Valtrex and Acyclovir.

No one really knows if it will continue to decline, level off or go back up. I would guess it will continue to decline at a modest rate or possibly level off. I am just saying you cannot make a good case that over the last 10 years we saw a decline of 4% or so in HSV-2 infection and from that project an increase of 33% over the next ten to fifteen years. That is simply absurd.

Obviously including HSV in STD tests would be a good way to encourage the downward trend.

Back on the original subject this supports data by the international herpes management forum that states 80% of those with GH are undiagnosed, however only 20% are truly asymptomatic where 60% are classified as "unrecognized symptomatic"...SIXTY PERCENT! That is crazy

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Now18

I have told a bunch of my friends about being positive. A lot of them are emotionally supportive, but will only one plans get tested for herpes. Even though not one of my friends has slept with less people than me. I think I should be the example that anyone could get it. But to make themselves feel better, they view me as this rare case of a nice girl being taken advantage of by a horrible player. Of course, none of them would ever get involved with a guy like THAT.

I also hate... the "I could tell if someone would be the type to have it." Oh really? Because I have it and am considered the good, girl next door type. I have only kissed 5 guys. People make fun of me for being prude because I don't like casual hooking up. I am also very health conscious and was ironically paranoid of STDs before I got HSV. I actually think that this paranoia is the only reason that I know that I have it.

People just don't want to believe that they're safe as long as they take reasonable precautions. And they also like to believe that people deserve what they get. It's so absurd that the same people who are scared of getting herpes from saliva or a towel (which is impossible or so unlikely that it's basically impossible)... are not scared about getting it from having sex with someone who's not been tested.

I'm not sure about the stats, I know the prevalence of GHSV2 is going down, but isn't the presence of GHSV1 going up? The majority of the spreading has to be from people that don't know they have it. Because the percentages are pretty low if you know that you have it and avoid sex during OBs. I'm sure that there's a lot of variables that will determine whether the prevalence goes up or down, and I think it's impossible to predict it because it's too complicated.

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ntdc

I'm not sure about the stats, I know the prevalence of GHSV2 is going down, but isn't the presence of GHSV1 going up?

No the overall presence of HSV-1 and HSV-2 in the general population is decreasing. HSV-1 is rising as a cause of genital herpes (versus oral), but infection rates are still falling.

That is to say if 1990 ten people had genital herpes 9 or 10 would have had it caused by HSV-2. In 2009 if ten people have genital herpes 5 may have HSV-1.

Overall the rates are still declining., including HSV-1.

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Now18

Yeah, I meant just genital HSV-1. Isn't the decline in oral HSV-1 actually a reason for the rise in more genital cases? Because less people have antibodies?

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jericho
No the overall presence of HSV-1 and HSV-2 in the general population is decreasing. HSV-1 is rising as a cause of genital herpes (versus oral), but infection rates are still falling.

That is to say if 1990 ten people had genital herpes 9 or 10 would have had it caused by HSV-2. In 2009 if ten people have genital herpes 5 may have HSV-1.

Overall the rates are still declining., including HSV-1.

I agree. The data suggests prevalence of both HSV-1 and HSV-2 are decreasing.

Yeah, I meant just genital HSV-1. Isn't the decline in oral HSV-1 actually a reason for the rise in more genital cases? Because less people have antibodies?

That probably has something to do with it. Also, oral sex seems to be on the rise, and oral-genital is by far the most common way to transmit GHSV-1.

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Limeinthecoconut

"He can tell when a woman has it"....fucking really? WOW good for you luckyCat for getting this douche bag out of your life.....just reading that pissed me off!!!

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gotitsowhat

No, it's not a river in Egypt...

Thanks for the support/feedback guys! Its sooo frustrating to have intelligent people just disregard basic facts in favor of what they want to believe. But I guess people do that all the time, not just with herpes...

Yes, they certainly do. That's why no ordinary citizen in the United States knows who pulled the trigger on Pres. Kennedy NEARLY HALF A CENTURY AFTER THE EVENT. There is not enough political pressure and momentum to get the records declassified.

It's the same reason why cheating spouses get away with it so much and for so long--spouses are always the last ones to know because they really do not want to know. Betrayal is hard to face. And, like the Kennedy assassination, they are not sure what they would do about it if they did know. Knowing would require some action, maybe some courage or some difficult choices. People don't like that. It's easier to pretend everything is OK.

A friend of mine who was in perfect health, and had just had a perfect medical workup and exam, and who was 39 years old, died suddenly. He just fell down dead. He was living in a foreign country. His family refused to look into it, accepting the idea that he had just suddenly died of an apparent heart attack. They found an excuse not to do an autopsy. They did not consider investigating the situation. I decided that I wanted to know what happened. Since my friend's death happened in a foreign country, it took a while to figure it out. Eventually, I figured out that he was murdered. I also figured out which two people did it. I do not think the murder can be proved easily, do not think the world or my friend's family would benefit if the two people were convicted (the story is complicated). Nevertheless, although I have not communicated my information to my deceased friend's family, I find myself wishing that they had not been in such massive denial. I guess his death was enough for them to deal with. I know they would never consider that his death was anything but just a natural death. Amazing, isn't it?

Sometimes I think people are in denial about much of what goes on in their lives. It seems to be human trait. Herpes is certainly a case in point.

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ntdc

Yes, they certainly do. That's why no ordinary citizen in the United States knows who pulled the trigger on Pres. Kennedy NEARLY HALF A CENTURY AFTER THE EVENT. There is not enough political pressure and momentum to get the records declassified.

err..not to get too far off track but everyone knows who killed him it was Oswald, there is no credible evidence to the contrary.

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jericho
err..not to get too far off track but everyone knows who killed him it was Oswald, there is no credible evidence to the contrary.

Can't say I know much about this, but there is some evidence that purports to show that it would have been almost impossible for someone to hit a moving target multiple times at that distance using the rifle Oswald was said to have used. And I think I saw something about Oswald not being a trained sharpshooter.

There's also an argument about the angle at which the bullets must have entered that are not consistent with Oswald's position.

Slightly more on topic or at least more on forum - it is thought that JFK had GH.

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ntdc

All of that stuff is baloney and has been debunked over and over again. Hell even discovery channel debunked the "magic bullet" its based on a common misconception about where connolly was sitting. Have you been to dealey plaza? He could have hit Kennedy with a brick. Oswald could have hit the target from that distance with that rifle his military records back this up he was qualfied as a sharpshooter in the marines.

Also you have to wonder about this...

I read recently that Squeaky Fromme is getting out of prison. I've heard John Hinkley may be getting out too. Why is there no conspiracy theories involving either of these two? Can you only be a lone nut if you try to kill a president and fail?

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dumplinsmom

Not Gonna Happen

I agree with a lot of the other responders. If people continue to ignore the signs and have sex, how can the rate possibly go down?? You also have to take into account that kids are having sex at an earlier age now and sleeping around is a competition for them. Then you have people who know they have HSV and continue to have sex without disclosing their status.

I have a friend who tells me about how she had sex with this guy one night, then the next night she had sex with someone else, it makes my stomach hurt, I'm disgusted!!! Why, because they have no idea how they are putting themselves at risk for getting HSV, or any other STD for that matter. Now keep in mind that the friend I'm speaking of is aware of my situation. So, I think, "If I know what I know about HSV, I would take all the necessary precautions and not mess around with all these men. I would make sure WE are tested before proceesding." It makes me sooooo angry when my friend sleeps around like that after I have told her how easily it is to get HSV. Now if she gets it, she's going to want my sympathy but.......I don't know if I would have any for her since she's so careless now. I have stopped talking about HSV because obviously, that's not important to her, of course since she doesn't have it. I think the misconception is that as long as a condom is being worn, they have nothing to worry about. WRONG!!

Many people are in denial. I just had a conversation with someone last night about "reoccurring yeast infections". I hesitated on mentioning HSV then, but I think I'm going to give her a call today and tell her she may want to be tested.

I would really love to see the rate go down, but I just can't see this happening.

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    • rareangel
      You really need to slow down or stop with your fear mongering. You are not deep in things of this nature as I am and we know the bottlenecks we face everytime we offer proof of what we have achieved as naturopaths. We are often rejected right at the door but does that stop us? Those who manage to accept us end up declaring what we do ineffective but later turn around and synthesize what we provided and began using it themselves simply because they believe they are more scientific than we are.   Much of conventional medicine was derived from nature and that should let you know that nature already holds most of the answers to our health but if anyone can easily get help from nature, then where is the money in it for big pharma? Diet alone does not handle hsv. I included a diet plan in my response to you but besides that, there is also the remedy which is most important. (This should let you know that I know what I am doing and saying) I did not come to this forum to play cloaks and daggers with anyone but to genuinely help. You should sound more encouraging and not judgemental. Hsv isn't a life sentence as many have been made to believe.
    • rareangel
      Thank you for posting our email conversation and also thank you for proving what I said about the mindset of people toward naturopaths especially when you suggested I could be a millionaire if I approached a scientific body.    If unscientific people such as you can easily be this judgemental and bigoted, how then do you think the truly scientific ones can be? Hsv is not as difficult as it is made to look. Indeed no illness is with the right treatment all illnesses that do not require surgery are easy. I run my own tests and have treated my own patients and have my own proofs. Surely you wouldn't expect me to forgo a patient confidentiality clause and release information on my patients to just about everybody do you?   If you were my patient would you want me to splash your details all over the web so anyone can have access to it?   People are afraid of what they do not understand so I understand your position and mindset but try not to label people from your position of insecurity. Not all of us are insecure.
    • Roja
      I am judgemental with people who try to take advantage of thousands of people, yes. Because I am sure some of them believe what you say and spend their savings in your "cure". And btw, I am a big fan of natural remedies. I believe that diet is one of the best ways to handle the virus. But I am also aware of the fact that it is up to now not possible to "delete" the virus. Maybe big pharma is trying to hide something, yes, but I don't think every single doctor and medical professional is lying to us. These people are professionals, they studied the human body for years. Do you really think all the doctors around the world would hide a "cure" like this for money?
    • Roja
      So you did not "just join this group".    So yeah, for everyone who is interested, I'll copy your e-mail:  "Good morning [name], The treatment for hsv from me lasts for a minimum of 3 months. The sequence of treatments goes thus 1) month 1 takes care of every symptom of hsv 2 you would ordinarily experience prior to or during an outbreak such as itchy/tingling sensation, feverish feelings and water retaining breakouts. 2) month 2 is the full body flush also done with one of my remedies which is pleasant tasting and calming to the body. This dislodges the virus from whatever nerve endings it has gone into and causes a weakening of the cell membrane in its envelope stage. 3) month 3 is a repeat of month one plus extra. The virus is killed off after the once impossible to penetrate cell membrane had been weakened and breached by the flush. Virus dies and patient at this stage would feel totally renewed and refreshed and free. Patient may experience an outbreak during the course of treatment which is expected but the appearance of the outbreak would prove patient is on track and doing well because the outbreak would be totally different from what used to be as I guarantee, no feverish feelings, no itch or tingling and no water retention in any rash that may appear. By the time we are done you can say goodbye to any form of breakouts be they stress triggered or not as you test negative. My remedy has zero side effects and works like a charm. Cost for each months treatment stands at $380. Patient has the option of running a monthly treatment thus paying monthly or paying for the entire 3 months and receiving all the remedies for the entire 3 months with directions on how to prepare them and the dose to take per time. Patient would also be required to keep in touch with me thus providing me with updates regarding progress reports so I can know if there is need to increase the dosage or leave it as it is. A diet plan would also be provided for the patient during the course of treatment. Long story short, I will work with patient for the entire 3 months of treatment up to the point of testing negative. Good morning once again. [Name]" So: 1) Not even one scientific proof. How should anyone believe your clients are "negative" if you can't prove?  2) 380 x 3 = 1140 $ for something that has no scientific proof at all AND moreover for something that up to now is IMPOSSIBLE. "This dislodges the virus from whatever nerve endings it has gone." Come on, that is impossible, as well as killing HSV from anyone's blood!  Again, you are a scam. And I feel so sad for all these desperate people who pay you a minimum of 1140$ for a treatment that doesn't work. 
    • rareangel
      The rule here says you should not be judgemental and you are already judgemental.   We are communicating via email and you got my permission to post whatever we discuss via email on this forum and I just sent you your first detailed reply and you are yet to post it here yet you have already labelled me a scam.  Do you now see why I said earlier that we naturopath's get the short end of the stick from skeptics like you?   I suggest you make amends to your post and stop being in a hurry to label everyone you see.
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